• Stephen Lee

    This is an excellent blog, which highlights that Israel is not the Devil in human format, as many would like us to believe.

  • http://www.avrammeitner.com/ Avram Meitner

    I lost track of the nonsense in this article by the end of the first paragraph. I’m not even sure it’s worth fisking, but…

    “For instance no one told Mahmoud Abbas, the leader of the more moderate Fatah Group to refuse to talk to Israel for the past few years.”

    He hasn’t refused, he just hasn’t agreed to Netanyahu’s extreme preconditions such as the suspension of international law.

    “Nobody told [Hamas] to continue to call for Israel’s destruction and refuse to denounce its own charter, which quotes the old antisemitic forgery the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.”

    They don’t. Their charter was abandoned as irrelevant years ago. The platform on which they were elected never even mentioned Israel. Compare this to the Likud charter for example, which calls for Palestine to be wiped off the map;

    “Rather than being a terrorist state, Israel, throughout its existence, has had to frequently defend itself from terrorism.”

    Which is only true of you define “terrorism” as “what they do to us, rather than what we do to them”.

    “Consequently, to paint a nation, which itself is besieged by terrorism, as a terrorist state is deeply wrongheaded.”

    I agree it’s not a useful designation. Israelis *are* the victim of terrorist attacks. But Israel also perpetrates terrorist attacks.

    “Additionally, Israel tries to avoid the loss of Palestinian lives.”

    A statement in clear contrast to the documentary record. During the Gaza massacre for example, the death toll of 1400 comprised of 1000 civilians, mostly women and children.

    “Moreover, Israel has been allowing many loads of building materials into Gaza, the like of which we have never allowed before, since Operation Pillar of Defence.”

    How many lorry loads are required? How many are let through? What right does Israel have to restrict them at all?

    “It’s also important to note that Israel over time has shown it’s not extreme.”

    Quite the opposite.

    “They signed up to the Oslo Accords led by Yitzhak Rabin, to agree peace with the Palestinian people.”

    Netanyahu is on video bragging about how he undermined them and made them unworkable.

    “…Prime Minister Netanyahu…froze settlement building for 10 months in 2010, in order to try and kick start negotiations with the Palestinians.”

    It’s a myth. It never happened. There was a minor decrease in the rate at which Palestinian land was stolen and illegally colonised. There was never a moratorium.

    “Indeed, in his Bar Ilan Speech in 2009, Netanyahu committed himself to the two state solution”

    The Likud charter, the document upon which they were elected expressly forbids a two state solution,

    Like it or not, the “solution” is there for the taking. The UN has recognised Palestine along the 67 lines. There is also the Saudi peace plan about which Israel refused to speak.

    Israel has only to observe international law. It’s not complex. It’s not controversial. Netanyahu’s extreme precondition that international law is suspended is one of the largest obstacles to the two-state solution.

    The term “terrorist state” has little meaning. Does Israel commit acts of terrorism? Of course. Does it suffer acts of terrorism? Of course.

  • http://www.facebook.com/stephen.hoffman2 Stephen Hoffman

    “Whoever is killed by a Jew receives the reward of two martyrs, because the very thing that the Jews did to the prophets was done to him.

    “The Jews are the most despicable and contemptible nation to crawl upon the face of the Earth, because they have displayed hostility to Allah.

    “Allah will kill the Jews in the hell of the world to come, just like they killed the believers in the hell of this world.

    “The Jews kill anyone who believes in Allah. They do not want to see any peace whatsoever on Earth.”

    (Sermon delivered by ‘Atallah Abu Al-Subh, former Hamas minister of culture, which aired on Al-Aqsa TV, April 8, 2011, translation by MEMRI).

    Or some Holocaust denial: The lie of the Zionist Holocaust crumbles with countless holocausts committed by the Zionists in Beit Hanoun, al-Fakhoura school and other places in Palestine.”

    (Hamas leader Mahmoud al-Zahar

    Now whatever your opinion on Israel- surely you cannot defend Holocaust denial- promoted by Hamas.

    Just to remind you that Hamas is an active terror group- who currently is attempting to fire numerous rockets into Israel’s, here’s Khaled Meshaal calling for suicide bombings:

    “This is the time for the third uprising… Resistance will continue through suicide missions.”

    (Hamas leader-in-exile Khaled Mashaal, Damascus, Syria, December 27, 2008).

    I could go on to remind you of the vile nature of Hamas that you appear to be either forgeting or wilfully ignoring, but I think I’ve made my point on this. If you still want to defend Hamas after this then that’s your perogative, but don’t expect many people to think you have any credibility on this subject if you do!

    Also in case you’ve forgotten-and I’m not a supporter of Netanyahu, but I am a supporter of the truth. Netanyahu, leader of likud since 2009 has made it clear he supports the two state solution- since his Bar Ilan speech on the matter. He again made this clear during the recent press conference with Barack Obama. As Likud’s leader he certainly wasn’t calling for the Palestinian State’s destruction.

    Also why do you star Israel *are* the victims of terror attacks in a way that appears to belittle their sufferings.

    On Operation Cast lead, no accurate numbers could be made but the Goldstone report, which I’m assuming your basing your numbers on has been shown to be a total fraud. Indeed, Sir Richard Goldstone who wrote the report has even disowned it, admitting that the figures he got came solely from figures from the Palestinian side and in particular Hamas. Also, one has to remember that during Operation Cast Lead Hamas even hid in civilian clothes, so some of those classified as civilians were nothing of the sort.

    He did freeze settlement building- its as simple as that. I’m sorry you have an aversion to the facts- that don’t fit into your worldview of Israel as the bad guy.

    When it comes to the Oslo accords- when exactly did I mention Netanyahu there. Netanyahu did oppose the Oslo accords at the time, but every Israeli prime minister since Rabin has in effect spoken in support of them, culminating in Netanyahu’s support for the two state solution, as mentioned above.

    The Saudi peace plan which you refer to was a non starter for one simple fact, it called for the return of all Palestinian refugees to Israel. This in practice would lead to the destruction of Israel and also ignores the fact that 800,000 Jews from Arab lands including my grandparents from Iraq were kicked out in 1948 for the simple reason they were Jews.

    As I made clear in my article I support the two state solution- based on 67 lines, so I don’t disagree with you if that’s what you support. I do have a problem though with your narrative saying that Israel is the sole reason for the failure of the peace process. Its simply factually incorrect and ignores the role of Palestinian leaders.

    This article if it wasn’t made clear was responding to a previous article where Israel was called a terorrist state. I was given a right of reply, I used it. Oh by the way returning to the first sentence.. its quite funny that you say my article is full of nonsense, when you go on a rant after this sentence, which has more hot air in it then a hot air baloon and has more nonsense contained it it then Ed Ball’s plans to the UK economy.

  • Truth

    Israel is an apartheid state that deliberately murders children. The writer of this article should have the class to criticise its flaws instead of defending them.